• Sen. Tom Cotton Claims that Tim Cook "Omitted Critical Facts" from his Recent Interview



    In a recently issued statement, US Senator Tom Cotton, who is a Republican from Arkansas, criticized Tim Cook for his defense of strong encryption during a 60 Minutes interview. He claimed that the Apple CEO had ďomitted critical facts.Ē Cotton said the following gin a statement regarding the matter:

    As a society, we don't allow phone companies to design their systems to avoid lawful, court-ordered searches. If we apply a different legal standard to companies like Apple, Google, and Facebook, we can expect them to become the preferred messaging services of child pornographers, drug traffickers, and terrorists alike ó which neither these companies nor law enforcement want.
    Cook argued against government-mandated backdoors in encryption during his 60 Minutes piece. The executive maintained a long-held position that if Apple coded backdoors for US law enforcement and spy agencies, the same holes could be exploited by malicious hackers, including governments who want to use the Internet against their own citizens.

    For those of you who didnít know, the Cupertino California company and other corporations have been in the limelight ever since US government officials have expressed concern that they wonít be able to intercept communications from criminals or terrorists. More specifically, the encryption present in iOS 8 and 9 for instance is so powerful that even Apple canít break it, even when served with a warrant.

    Whatís your stance on the controversial matter? Share your thoughts below!

    Source: CBS News (60 Minutes), Tom Cotton (Press Release)
    This article was originally published in forum thread: Sen. Tom Cotton Claims that Tim Cook "Omitted Critical Facts" from his Recent Interview started by Akshay Masand View original post
    Comments 21 Comments
    1. magusxxx's Avatar
      magusxxx -
      "As a society, we don't allow phone companies to design their systems to avoid lawful, court-ordered searches. " - But you have no problem with the Senate, the FDA, the Military, etc, doing the same thing.
    1. tridley68's Avatar
      tridley68 -
      Thank you Tim Cook for standing up for what is right .
    1. Ambi_Valence's Avatar
      Ambi_Valence -
      Quote Originally Posted by tridley68 View Post
      Thank you Tim Cook for standing up for what is right .
      In this instance maybe. That aside like many other company CEOs Tim Cook is a thieving asshat as he runs his business trying to find loopholes to avoid paying tax. He might do it legally but he knows itís wrong.
    1. bigbaba's Avatar
      bigbaba -
      Quote Originally Posted by Ambi_Valence View Post
      In this instance maybe. That aside like many other company CEOs Tim Cook is a thieving asshat as he runs his business trying to find loopholes to avoid paying tax. He might do it legally but he knows itís wrong.
      Actually the tax system is so convioluted and ambiguous which leads to a large grey area. That's why you have so many levels of accountants and lawyers who specialize in taxation. It's the system that is broken. It should be made into a flat tax system. Replace the entire tax act with 1 page.
    1. Ambi_Valence's Avatar
      Ambi_Valence -
      Quote Originally Posted by bigbaba View Post
      Actually the tax system is so convioluted and ambiguous which leads to a large grey area. That's why you have so many levels of accountants and lawyers who specialize in taxation. It's the system that is broken. It should be made into a flat tax system. Replace the entire tax act with 1 page.
      I didn’t say it wasn’t. Lots of the laws we have concerning all sorts of things, Health and Safety for example have loads of contradictions and things that are open to interpretation. What I’m saying is this;
      You know that the idea is, that you are supposed to slow down outside a school and in built up areas, the law is supposed to enforce this. But if you drive fast because you know there is a loophole in the law that makes it legal you are being dishonest. You’re not breaking the law as you have found a way to remain within it using clever lawyers and interpretation but you KNOW you should really be doing otherwise.

      That is how Cook is operating, you know it, he knows it and I know it. As, by the way are the people that run my company and countless others. I’m not saying he’s alone in this, I’m saying don’t make excuses for his dishonest behaviour.
      You can choose to do the right thing if you want.
    1. bigbaba's Avatar
      bigbaba -
      Quote Originally Posted by Ambi_Valence View Post
      I didnít say it wasnít. Lots of the laws we have concerning all sorts of things, Health and Safety for example have loads of contradictions and things that are open to interpretation. What Iím saying is this;
      You know that the idea is, that you are supposed to slow down outside a school and in built up areas, the law is supposed to enforce this. But if you drive fast because you know there is a loophole in the law that makes it legal you are being dishonest. Youíre not breaking the law as you have found a way to remain within it using clever lawyers and interpretation but you KNOW you should really be doing otherwise.

      That is how Cook is operating, you know it, he knows it and I know it. As, by the way are the people that run my company and countless others. Iím not saying heís alone in this, Iím saying donít make excuses for his dishonest behaviour.
      You can choose to do the right thing if you want.
      But what makes it wrong? An antiquated law that could not anticipate present day conditions? To take your speeding analogy and put it in context: if flying cars, which are build to travel 300 ft above the ground, are commonplace should they be subject to the same speed laws/norms/guidelines as land travel? If I am flying 300 ft above ground should I slow down (and risk stalling/crashing) because the guidelines which were made during the Ford Model T era say I should in that vicinity? I mean if you look in the context of tax law alcohol should still be illegal. There was essentially no multinational trade during that time as it exists today.

      The law is outdated and so is your way of thinking. Welcome to the 21st century, you're only 16 years late.
    1. mcarchos's Avatar
      mcarchos -
      Just goes to show how stupid politicians are. If Apple and other companies become required to write back doors into their systems and people know it everyone will just stay on the older secured systems even if it means never upgrading their hardware. This move would do nothing but harm the economy and businesses.
    1. Ambi_Valence's Avatar
      Ambi_Valence -
      Quote Originally Posted by bigbaba View Post
      But what makes it wrong? An antiquated law that could not anticipate present day conditions? To take your speeding analogy and put it in context: if flying cars, which are build to travel 300 ft above the ground, are commonplace should they be subject to the same speed laws/norms/guidelines as land travel? If I am flying 300 ft above ground should I slow down (and risk stalling/crashing) because the guidelines which were made during the Ford Model T era say I should in that vicinity? I mean if you look in the context of tax law alcohol should still be illegal. There was essentially no multinational trade during that time as it exists today.

      The law is outdated and so is your way of thinking. Welcome to the 21st century, you're only 16 years late.
      Your analogy is not even close. If you found a way to make the judge believe you were gliding and not flying that’s more what I’m getting at.

      If you know what the spirit of the law is and go out of your way to find yourself a method of doing what is deemed to be wrong but still find it legal. It’s devious/dishonest what ever you want to call it. But let’s not pretend that you are un upstanding member of the community.
      There are byelaws that mean we can do all sorts of despicable things to each other and it’s legal. Morally it’s wrong.

      But back on topic now, sort of.
    1. Purple Minion's Avatar
      Purple Minion -
      I think the critical fact Tom Cotton is referring to is that Congress is full of ignorant, arrogant buffoons.
    1. Ambi_Valence's Avatar
      Ambi_Valence -
      Quote Originally Posted by Purple Minion View Post
      I think the critical fact Tom Cotton is referring to is that Congress is full of ignorant, arrogant buffoons.
      I don’t disagree. Large global private enterprises are too……..
    1. bigbaba's Avatar
      bigbaba -
      Quote Originally Posted by Ambi_Valence View Post
      Your analogy is not even close. If you found a way to make the judge believe you were gliding and not flying thatís more what Iím getting at.
      Actually I was comparing driving on land to flying so you can glide too if you want. The point I was trying to make before your attempt at misdirecting it was trying to judge something new and modern with old laws which are almost a century old. Do you think the sodomy laws that were enacted over a century ago and most states have today are valid? No, they are just as outdated. I guess I acted too hastily in my last response when I welcomed you to the 21st century; I will now invite you to join us in it. Please join us when you can.

      Quote Originally Posted by Ambi_Valence View Post
      If you know what the spirit of the law is and go out of your way to find yourself a method of doing what is deemed to be wrong but still find it legal. Itís devious/dishonest what ever you want to call it. But letís not pretend that you are un upstanding member of the community.
      Exactly which morals are you using to gauge what it right and wrong when it comes to taxation? A system that could not comprehend present day business? How many companies were formed that while were headquartered in the US but had a large portion of their sales out of the country? I don't think you realize the scope of what is going on here. Apple isn't exporting its US profits; they are just not bringing their foreign profits which are made in foreign countries in foreign currencies to the US. How can you explain that as devious/dishonest?

      Quote Originally Posted by Ambi_Valence View Post
      There are byelaws that mean we can do all sorts of despicable things to each other and itís legal. Morally itís wrong.

      But back on topic now, sort of.
      Again, no one did anything to you or your country except make money in a foreign land and keep it there. Who are you to say how someone else should spend their money?
    1. Ambi_Valence's Avatar
      Ambi_Valence -
      LOL. Rubbish.
      When the laws are updated Cook and his type will again employ and army of lawyers to circumvent them. How much goods and services do you think Apple sell to the the Irish public, I mean seriously?
      When he can no longer use the 'out of date' tax laws to justify his actions he’ll make up another reason.
      They funnel all that money through a country in which they sell proportionally, almost no hardware, software or services. They are not even paying proper taxes in those other foreign countries either.

      You sound like an apologist. Understand, I’m not getting at Cook alone. These company bosses are all crooks that play on a playing field that nobody else has access to.
    1. bigbaba's Avatar
      bigbaba -
      I don't know what Apple's sales are like in Ireland but I can tell you this much: they weren't in US dollars. The same goes for all the money that Apple has sitting in Ireland. Ireland just happens to be a progressive nation that encourages investment.

      Now let's assume I have a few stores which I sell goods from. My headquarters is in New York State and I have other stores in New Jersey. If my company is set up right I pay state taxes in New York for my New York sales and I pay state taxes in New Jersey for New Jersey sales. There is nothing "morally" wrong with this scenerio or dishonest as this is how things are supposed to be done.

      This happens state side all the time. I don't know why you have such a big problem with it. I think it has a lot to do with the thumb in your mouth that you use as your moral compass
    1. Ambi_Valence's Avatar
      Ambi_Valence -
      Quote Originally Posted by bigbaba View Post
      I don't know what Apple's sales are like in Ireland but I can tell you this much: they weren't in US dollars. The same goes for all the money that Apple has sitting in Ireland. Ireland just happens to be a progressive nation that encourages investment.

      Now let's assume I have a few stores which I sell goods from. My headquarters is in New York State and I have other stores in New Jersey. If my company is set up right I pay state taxes in New York for my New York sales and I pay state taxes in New Jersey for New Jersey sales. There is nothing "morally" wrong with this scenerio or dishonest as this is how things are supposed to be done.

      This happens state side all the time. I don't know why you have such a big problem with it. I think it has a lot to do with the thumb in your mouth that you use as your moral compass
      LOL, you are funny. We both know that Apple are in Ireland for a reason. It has little to do with how progressive Apple think they are and more to do with how much tax they can avoid paying.
      I don’t give a crap what Apple do in the US. But in the UK, play by the rules properly or bugger off. Their employees still benefit from the NHS 'free at the point of delivery' system but they don’t contribute properly to it.

      Anyhow, it’s late here. Merry Christmas.
    1. bigbaba's Avatar
      bigbaba -
      Wow you regressed into immaturity very quickly. Could it be you are frustrated with the realization that you have no point to argue? Is that why all the emotions are coming out?

      Merry Christmas to you too! I hope when you go downstairs tomorrow that mommy and daddy put a lot of shiny new apple stuff for you to unwrap!
    1. Ambi_Valence's Avatar
      Ambi_Valence -
      Quote Originally Posted by bigbaba View Post
      Wow you regressed into immaturity very quickly. Could it be you are frustrated with the realization that you have no point to argue? Is that why all the emotions are coming out?

      Merry Christmas to you too! I hope when you go downstairs tomorrow that mommy and daddy put a lot of shiny new apple stuff for you to unwrap!
      What on earth are you talking about?
      My mommy and daddy have since passed away but thanks.
    1. NewD's Avatar
      NewD -
      Bigbaba and Ambi_Valence,
      Actually you're both right.. Apple for sure evades taxes by moving off US soul AND Apple will always try to circumvent even the most simple attempts to keep its citizens safe by playing the "old technology" card. It's not sticking to old technology for the government to want to keep its people safe.
    1. sheltons.iphone's Avatar
      sheltons.iphone -
      Until there is a GLOBAL tax rate, companies will continue to headquarter, warehouse, and employ the most workers where it is cheapest to do it. There's nothing morally wrong about it, it's good business sense.
    1. ishamiyal's Avatar
      ishamiyal -
      Quote Originally Posted by bigbaba View Post
      I think it has a lot to do with the thumb in your mouth that you use as your moral compass
      Having read through all these comments, what I take away is that you have a personal issue with somebody that 'gets away' with something you don't feel you can. I'm gonna go out on a limb here are assume you are liberal.

      Explain to me, as a business owner, where you infer my "moral obligation", from the civil or tax code? I didn't go into business to give away 'my fair share' because I'm a 'good citizen'. It's a business, by definition, the point is to make money. Tim Cook has an obligation to the stock holders long before he does the Tax Payers, especially liberal deadbeats whining about evil corporations not paying for their entitlement programs.

      Neither I, nor Tim Cook, wrote the tax law we find ourselves encumbered by. But I can assure you, the first time I broke the $150K mark and ended up giving away a ton of my hard earned cash to the moronic Fed, the only thing I was thinking about was 'tax shelter'. You don't like the rules of the game, change them- but stop whining about people playing it better than you think they should be able to.
    1. quidam_brujah's Avatar
      quidam_brujah -
      I'm lost... was this post about the government forcing businesses to build in backdoors, or about taxes?
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